Episode # 115- Shelby’s Healing Journey and Energy Hacks

I love this interview with one of my favorite people, Shelby Hansen.

 

She shares her healing journey including overcoming decades of hip pain to run a pain-free triathalon.

 

Shelby is a coach for moms with Chronic Fatigue, and she shares with us some energy hacks that anyone can use to feel better in life.

 

You can find Shelby on her website https://shelbykhansen.com/

And download her top 3 Energy Tips here: https://view.flodesk.com/pages/63dc400c8e06d4dae9492ea0

 

 

For weekly calls and community support integrating this work into your life, check out Alignment Academy:

https://www.bodyandmindlifecoach.com/alignment-academy-membership

 

Please subscribe and share this podcast with someone who might love it!

 

For fresh content on healing chronic pain or disease, follow Betsy

on Instagram https://www.instagram.com/bodyandmindlifecoach/

 

Youtube https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCvXZSYYGL2cfJl-oEOzqspA

 

Website https://bodyandmindlifecoach.com

 

*Free Nervous System Modules- 4 free videos explaining the nervous system, how it affects your health, and how to regulate it  https://view.flodesk.com/pages/620ffa96e0eda1a0d870b5a6

 

*Curable App- 6 Weeks Free with this code http://www.curable.com/betsyjensen

 

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Transcript- Automatically Generated:

This is Betsy Jensen, and you are listening to Unstoppable Body and Mind, Episode 115, Shelby's Healing Journey and Energy Hacks. In this podcast, we learned to upgrade our brain and understand the power of our thoughts, to heal and to create the results we want in our life. Become the person in control of your healing and make peace with your life.
Become Unstoppable Body and Mind. All right, everyone, welcome. I'm so excited today to have a special guest, my friend, a fellow coach, she's been a client, all of the things, Shelby Hansen.
Welcome, Shelby.
Thanks so much for this opportunity.
I'm so happy to have you here. Every time we talk, just feels so good. You've been doing this work for a while, your story is amazing, what brought you here?
And you coach women that have chronic fatigue and have special tips about energy that I also thought might be helpful to everyone. Not even if you just have chronic fatigue, but you had a poor night's sleep or you, however it might fit in, if it's more of a freeze type of symptom, which I'm sure we will talk about later. So anyway, I just really wanted to have you on the podcast.
I'm glad you agreed to come and share with us your story and your wisdom. Absolutely. Oh, yeah.
Well, can I just start about how I found you? Oh, I would love it. So like Betsy said, we're both coaches and I was on a Facebook group and she had talked about doing this book club for The Way Out and that was back in October of 2021.
I was newly certified as a coach and I had just had, or maybe it was November. I don't know. I just had a jaw surgery in October of 2021 and the pain was not going away.
I'm not somebody that takes a lot of pain medications. So I took a pain. My pain had started to kind of subside and then it got worse a few weeks after the surgery.
And I took one of the medications and it didn't touch the pain at all. And I was like, what is going on? There's something.
I knew there was something emotional happening, but I didn't know what it was. And so I saw that you were talking about chronic pain, which I've been coaching women that experienced chronic illness and now specifically chronic fatigue for a long time. And chronic pain goes hand in hand with so many of those conditions.
And I was like, I got to find out more about this chronic pain. So I joined your book club. And during that time, I was sitting in my chair.
I was 20 pounds heavier than I've ever been. Hadn't been really working out. And you were talking about having us imagine doing an activity that would cause pain and I imagined running because since I was 14 years old, I would experience pain in my hip when I would run.
And so, but it would only happen after I had run or while I was running and I hadn't run in months and I was sitting there, closing my eyes, imagining myself running on the beach and my hip started to hurt.
In real life, I hadn't even moved at all. And I was like, what did Betsy just do?
Your brain, what did your brain just do?
Right.
I mean, yeah, it is like magical sometimes and seems really like a cool party trick, but pain is just this creation of your brain and we can reroute those neural pathways and feel different things and mess with your brain and see those things.
That's when I knew in that moment, I was like, this is neuroplastic. I'm not neuroplastic, I've never heard this term before. Whatever's going on is neuroplastic because I had been, like I said, since I was 14 years old, in cross country.
I remember the moment it happened and unlearning that is actually what helped. But I'd been to physical therapists, I've been to all of the doctors. They told me I had hip bursitis, I'd had x-rays and podiatrists, like all of the things, done the physical therapy and nothing could touch it.
Yeah. And so it wasn't like it hurt all the time, but it was related to activity. And so then that belief formed of like, oh, the activity causes it and then the life adapts around it.
Oh, I just don't run anymore. So, yeah.
Exactly. So then when you open up your Alignment Academy in February, I was like, I'm all in. So and when I did that too, I went into it with this really aligned goal that I wanted to be able to complete a triathlon that summer.
That's right. Which was a lofty goal, I would say, right? For not even like, I don't think you could even run a mile at that point without me.
No, I couldn't. I couldn't.
Yeah.
I couldn't even run a mile like just like breathing.
Yeah. And so, and this was like February, I think we started and you were like, this summer, I'm going to do a triathlon.
Yeah.
Yeah, I remember that.
Yeah, I'm going to back up just a little bit. So I had a kidney transplant when I was 30, how old was I, 34? Yeah, 34 years old.
So I went into kidney failure when I was 31 years old. And so I had previously done triathlons, but I hadn't run one since my transplant. So, and obviously like I have been diagnosed with medical PTSD.
It was a very traumatic time in my life. I had a difficult healing after the surgery. So there was just a lot going on physically for me.
And also COVID didn't help with that because being somebody that's immunocompromised and then we were also moving because my husband's active duty military, there's just a lot of things that were going on. I lost my support groups, my support system, and that was what led to a lot of that inactivity and just being really disconnected from my body and being heavier. So back, a little bit before I started working with you, I mean, for the Alignment Academy, I decided that I really wanted my focus that year to be my health and I wanted to feel healthy.
And I was looking at that vision, I'm like, what would it be like if I felt healthy? What would that look, physically look like?
Oh, I love that question. Because so many people haven't even answered that for themselves. They can't even imagine it, but they want to feel healthy, but what does that even look like?
Yeah. And so for me, I was like, I would know, like, check the box that I'm healthy if I was running triathlons like I used to. And I know I've told you this before, because as high achievers, people pleasers, like overachievers, like these people that just push, push, push, that are the ones that experience chronic pain.
It's really easy to set a lofty goal and then like body to shut down and not want to complete that goal.
Well, can I even say, like, I love how you said you were really in alignment with it, because I think if you had that goal, like, I remember hearing that goal and kind of my own brain was saying like, that's a lot, like, I don't know that she should have that kind of goal, like, that's what my brain told me.
Good thing you never said that.
I know. But you were so in alignment with it. I was like, of course, I'm going to support that, right?
Like, but if you had had a lot of fear about it, like, this is what I need to do to be healthy, and I have to achieve it. Otherwise, I'm not successful, you would have had different feelings about it. And that triathlon would have been more like a lofty goal to really show, like you said, shut yourself down, and not achieve anything, versus like for you, it was totally aligned, meaning like, good to you, right?
How would you say that?
It did, because when I made that goal, I've been developing my relationship with my body, and like listening to that intuitive part of me. And so as I saw that vision in my mind of doing a triathlon, I also stopped because I did feel a little bit of that escalation in my nervous system, in my body. And I was like, oh, like I let my brain make this decision, I didn't consult my body yet.
And so I took a moment, and I literally like, I talked to my body all the time. I'm like, body, depressing you.
I love that.
I was like, body, do you want to do this? Like, do you want to run a triathlon? And I was open to any possibility that like, whatever feeling I was going to have.
And I just felt this like pulling forward, like, yeah, that sounds fun. Let's go do it.
Yeah. In Deb Dana's book, she says like, stretch, not stress. So I think if it's like in that stretchy, like a pull forward, it wasn't in your comfort zone, but it was like calling to you versus like when you stress the system too much, too soon, that's where it causes more dysregulation and more pain.
Yeah. Well, one of my coaches, too, she says that like, rather than pushing towards your dreams, like rather have your dream and let your like be pulled by your vision.
Yes. Yes. Like, yeah, not like pushing towards it, but like inspired by it and yeah, exactly.
It's all about, you know, that energy, the emotion behind it, you know, if it's lack based, then it will be like, oh, I have to do this in order to be better and feel better versus like, oh, okay, I just want to do something that is like, what is possible for me?
Yeah, exactly. So I entered Alignment Academy with this goal and I was like, you know what? From what Betsy is saying, I really think that I could run this, like complete the triathlon.
I think I could do it pain free. And so that was my, whenever I buy coaching, because I love coaching, I always think about what is it that I, what is my end goal and like the vision part, not the pushing part. But I'm just like, yeah.
Your intent.
Yeah. This is my intention. My intention out there, so yeah.
So that was a big part of it was just like, okay, starting really, really slowly and really small to see like, what is it that my body wants, getting the feedback from my body, getting the coaching when there was times when I felt a lot of pain and I'd be like, Betsy, what's going on?
Even though you have that belief, like when you start feeling pain and you've increased your running, there's a lot of like, you know, understandable concern. And I love like, I think back then that Alignment Academy was like a small group and it was a six month program. And so you gave yourself like six months to achieve that goal.
It wasn't like, I'm going to run a triathlon by the end of this month, you know, and I have to just like, hurry and force myself. Like, you were starting from really not even being a runner at all without pain. And then, you know, having that goal or that like vision for six months.
Yeah. Yeah. And, and as I would run in different places, try different things, like it was so fascinating just, just getting the feedback from my body.
Like, okay, this being the detective for the opposite on times when it's like, I had this whole run and I felt amazing the whole time. What was different than this time when I barely could even hold it together? And recognizing with that nervous system stuff going on.
Right. Because I remember sometimes like, I think you started on a treadmill, but then like going outside, you know, there's like hills and roots and branches and there's this concern of safety and your body naturally like tightened up in certain places and you felt pain.
Yeah, I remember too, I was running through a park one time and it was so funny. I would feel pain as soon as I thought that somebody could see me running.
Oh my gosh. I was like that connection.
Yeah, because I had never made that connection. In fact, it was one of the things that really helped to heal the pain was that I was so concerned about what other people were going to think about how I looked when I ran. How slow I was, like all of that.
I was so concerned and it was totally just putting me into fight or flight while I was running.
What if someone sees me? Yeah, you might have even subconsciously like sensed someone around you and all of a sudden then you have pain. And then what's funny is like, how would you have looked with pain anyway?
Like our brain creates like our fear anyway, you know what I mean?
And then like, it was so funny because I'd feel myself go into alignment and then it stopped hurting. And then I would feel myself go out, it would start and I was just like, oh my gosh, like I just felt like, you know, with one of those cogs in the wheel that it's just like, you know, it's not well oiled and it's like, it's like going and then it stops falling off the bike. But then it gets gone, I was like, this is so weird because I am just doing the same motion and I am having a really weird experience.
Yeah. And even saying alignment, like some people might think, oh, physical alignment. Like that's how I used to think, right?
Oh, because your step was the right length and you have perfect symmetry and your hips are strong. No, it's the mental, physical, spiritual, I don't know, whatever, the alignment of your emotions and your nervous system, the regulation or dysregulation of your nervous system. When things are safe, you don't have pain, you're flowing, it's easy, it's fun.
You would tune into nature. I know you would like...
Yeah, that's what I was just going to say. Part of that was like, I thought somebody was like paying attention to how I was running while I was running and then my ankles would start to hurt and both of my hips would start to hurt and then I would envision being out in a field and when I was like a little toddler, just running through grass just for fun and then the pain would just be like... But then I would go back to freaking out about something and it was just like back and forth.
But really, like you said, being in nature, tuning into what feels really, really good, like that is what helped me to really regulate and tuning into what my body was desiring.
Yes.
She didn't want me to hold still. She didn't want me to be on the couch and not exercising because that didn't feel good either.
Yeah, that's true. Our bodies love movement, but when we're so focused on the like, okay, I've got to move in this certain way so that I don't get hurt and I have to have this strength and I have... You know, that focuses on that fear versus when you're in that flow state, that parasympathetic calm state, the ventral state, you're not even thinking about the fear and the pain and you don't have it.
You're tuning in to other things and that's such an important point of this work. It's not just decreasing the fear, but like replacing it with something that feels good and is enjoyable and you're actually feeling safe in your body.
Yeah, and I had a powerful coaching from just a peer around that time and she had said something about, she's like, well, it sounds like you beat the odds to me. And I was like, oh my gosh, I have beat the odds. And so sometimes when I was running, I would physically hit my chest and tell myself, I beat the odds.
Like it's what I do, it's who I am. And it just felt so empowering and so just strong and strength. And instead of me thinking like this, this exercise is going to make me weaker, it's going to hurt my body, which is what I used to think, like running so glad for your body, it's bad for your joints, like all of the stories that people tell us, I'm like, no, this is stronger.
Yeah, totally shifted my experience.
Yes. I love that you said that because like, I just will put in this little thing, this little story from dancing where I started doing all of these like flips of my head and you know, rolling my neck and my my neck used to tighten up when I first started doing it. And then I could just like calm myself down and I would tell myself like, this motion is good for my neck like this.
It's good to have like full motion and be able to move it freely. And now my brain doesn't even produce it anymore and I do, you know, even more head rolls and all that stuff. But when I reacted with fear, you know, I was thinking like, what just happened?
Did I just pinch the synovial sac? You know, like, just the anatomy of it, I would tighten up more and have more pain. But when I was like, it's good for my body.
And there's actually so much research now about running, being good for arthritis, being good for back pain, like all these things we used to say. Now there's research saying the opposite. So it's so sad.
So yeah, one thing I will say is that it was pretty easy for me to unhook from the physical pain of the hip because I didn't have an injury that happened. And I feel like that was like a real advantage for me because I remember, like I said, I remember when it happened. I was 14 years old.
I was on a cross country team. We were living in Hawaii. We, like I was running in the rain.
We're running up this hill that was like really challenging. I was the last one. And I really feel like, and that's when I was like, oh, yeah, my, my, my hip hurts.
And that's when it started. There was no like real reason for it to start. It's not like I broke my leg or like, you know, something fell on it.
There was no like physical damage. So when you told me like, if you're like, this is neuroplastic, how you explained it and that there like, there was no physical reason for it to start, it was really easy for me to just believe like, oh, yeah, this is just my brain.
Well, that's so fascinating, Shelby, because really like you were running at the time. So like so many people that I've coached, like not only do they tie it to like, well, I was doing an activity at the time, but they reach back as far as like a month before that. And they'll be like, well, a month before the pain started, I was riding four wheelers.
Or two weeks before it started, I had an accident where I fell off a horse and then they didn't have pain. And then it started two weeks later. So it's like so interesting that you could detach from that, even though it wasn't like you were like, I was laying in bed and my hips started hurting.
You were actually running, but we want to see that just even just like normal running is not something that just injures your body, right? It doesn't like, like you said, it wasn't like something fell on you or that you fell down and broke your bone. Like it just tightened up and there was this emotional component going on.
Yeah, because I was, I was, I was holding up the team. Like it's a team score, like, I mean, it was just a practice, but, oh yeah. And the reason why I say that too, is because then I, you know, I had had the jaw surgery and that, you know, that I've gotten quite a bit of coaching on like tongue and like jaw pain and like all of that.
And that's been a lot harder for me to unhook from because I'm like, oh yeah, that's because of the surgery.
Yes. Yeah, it's so true. And when you have that belief that there is a physical problem, your brain is more likely to produce the pain.
Exactly. But yeah, that is so interesting.
And like it's been like in the past, like the last like few months or so, like the jaw stuff has kind of been flaring up. And so what I realized was that I was really hooked in to the story of the surgery causing the pain. So it's been so much better because I decided that the sensations have nothing to do with that surgery that happened two years ago.
Right. Yes. And that is so, so amazing that you can uncouple that and realize that.
And because so many times we just are under that belief like, oh, it's not perfect anymore. You know, there's been some damage. But what we really see is that even pain free people, if you did an MRI, so many of them have like anomalies or herniated discs or torn menisci or like different kinds of things.
We have these normal abnormalities and if your surgery has been more than three to six months ago, we're assuming and because this is what we see in this field that the structures have healed to the degree that they don't need to keep causing a chronic pain and chronic pain is a different type of pain than like normal surgical healing pain.
Yeah, exactly.
Yeah.
So, in August 2021, no, 2022, it was last summer, I signed up for the Cleveland Rock and Roll Hall of Fame Triathlon. I did the mini one, like my brain is like, I need to tell you guys, it was not very long, but like, come on brain.
I know, right? Oh, it's a mini triathlon.
It's a mini sprint, like it was like the shortest one that you can do. But I didn't care because that's my brain just wanted to see me doing a triathlon. So I signed up for it.
I did the swim part, no problem, did the bike, no problem, was right by one of the Great Lakes. I think it's Lake Erie. I could be wrong, but I think that's what it is.
Did the running and I was coming up around the bend and like feeling good. And as I was coming around and starting to go down this hill where I could see Lake Erie and see the beach area, legs started to seize up. I started to feel pain shooting up the sides of my ankles.
I don't think my hip was hurting at all. But I was just feeling really sharp. And I was just like, you know what?
In my brain, I wanted the pain to go away so bad because I just really, really wanted to do this with no pain. Right? And so it was making, because I was in resistance, it was making it even worse in the moment.
And so once I realized that, I was like, you know what? I just don't care if I feel pain while I do this. I just don't care.
And I told myself that this thought was so empowering for me in that moment. I said, I'm just willing to feel it all.
The pain went away right when you had that change of heart and that release of the resistance.
I didn't realize how hard I was resisting. And I was like, I'm just willing to feel it all. And my body was like, that's what I was waiting for.
Oh, this is so interesting. I mean, we just see this over and over and over and over, right? I'm sure you see it with every one of your clients.
And we see it in ourselves that the more we're resisting it, it builds, it holds on it, like, you know, festers or gets worse or what you think about you, you create more of. So the more we're in resistance to pain, the more pain we have to be resistant to.
Yeah. So, like I said, I just I sing Betsy's praises, I it's been so incredible working with her and just finding out that my body has such a bigger capacity to heal and to like how I feel in my body. I didn't know that was possible.
I thought that like this is just where I'm at and this is how I'm going to feel for the rest of my life. And I didn't realize that that was not true.
You probably had even been told like, well, you've had a kidney transplant in your thirties and that's so rare. We don't even know what it's going to be like, but you're probably going to have a lot of, you know, feelings of fatigue and not being able to do my, I don't know what you've been told, but it would be very understandable to just be like, yeah, this is my lot in life based on what I've been through.
Well, and you look at the medications that I'm on for life, like I'm on prednisone for the rest of my life. You know, heavy duty immunosuppressants. So I've been told all sorts of things, like scary things, and they're like, this thing, this thing.
I don't even say them out loud anymore though, because I'm just like, that doesn't help me. Because all it does is create fear. And so I am constantly on the look, detective for the opposite, for other people that have experienced similar things to me that are not these worst case scenarios that people warn me about.
Yes. Yes. I love that you mentioned detective for the opposite, one of the best tools, not only for pain, but literally any kind of limiting belief.
I've done that with, you know, I'm not a great mom. And then you look at the examples of how you are great in some moments, right? Like detective for the opposite, you can almost always, it's like an Amazon review.
I was thinking like, sometimes there's like a million five star reviews and there's one person that's like, I hated it. It didn't work for me at all. So you could be the opposite though of that, that's like more of a negative one.
But it's like, you can always find something, right? Like that's opposite of your belief. And if your belief is something about pain and like I have pain with sitting or with running or, you know, finding detective for the opposite moments is one of my favorite things to do to just rewire those neural circuits so much faster.
Yeah, I totally agree. So and then the other thing that you helped me with so much too was understanding my freeze response because that was my go to.
Oh my gosh. Let's talk about that. Because I think people identify with fight or flight a lot.
Like do you think that's like probably true with we hear about that more. We know what fight looks like. We know what flight looks like somewhat or, you know, we get it when we hear about it.
But freeze, I didn't realize about it either until like a few years.
Well, and that's what I that was the fatigue that I was experiencing because here I was, you know, like I said, had kidney failure and had debilitating fatigue and nausea because parts of my body were not clearing the toxins that they're meant to. And so my my blood was becoming toxic. And so having the kidney transplant that that remediated that problem.
And so, you know, you would think, OK, awesome. So she's not going to feel fatigue or nausea anymore because she has a working kidney. But that didn't happen for me.
I continue to feel that fatigue and nausea, even though I have a new organ that's helping. And so I was like, what is going on with this? And so just like the pain and healing that chronic neuroplastic pain, I applied those principles to the fatigue and nausea like you taught me to.
Yes. So that is so important, right? It's not just chronic pain, like, oh, my muscles hurt or a nerve pain.
It can be, I mean, of course, nausea, like the digestive issues are so affected by the nervous system, right? They're the first to shut off. If you're being chased by a tiger, you're not going to be digesting your food.
And then the fatigue, though, is such an interesting one because so many people just believe fatigue has to do with how much you sleep and what you put into your body, right? Like what you eat or don't eat and how much you sleep.
Yeah. And it's been so fascinating because I would feel this just like drain of energy, just like sucked of energy and just like couldn't do anything else. And I was like, oh, that's the fatigue.
And then I would talk to you about it and you'd be like, that's freeze.
Like, this is just like, this is what fatigue is. Yeah.
I mean, yeah, exactly. Cause we're kind of just trained to think like, oh, just something's hemically, physically wrong with me.
Yeah, exactly. And so, and again, like I would think, oh, it's like you said, it's something that I ate. Like I ate the wrong thing.
And I feel so terrible in my body and I'm so tired. I'm so sluggish. I just like, I can't do anything.
It was just very all or nothing thinking is what the freeze was, because I had exhausted all of my fight or flight frenzied. And then when I just felt so hopeless that whatever I was doing wasn't going to be fixed, then my body just went into this hopeless state and just all of the energy reserves are just gone.
Yes, because it's not just fatigue. There are emotions that go along with freeze. Do you want to talk about those for you?
Yeah, I mean, definitely, it's like the hopeless and the despair. Even disappointment can really bring that freeze.
And shame is a big one that we see.
I'm sorry. Yes.
Yeah. Who could forget that? But it's so insidious.
We're just like, oh, but this is true. It just feels true that we're bad at life. I always tell the example with freeze of I was getting coached, and I was saying how everything was bad.
I'm a bad mom, bad coach. Everything's going horribly. And I had 10 people in my yoga class, but I was still like, which is a good number for me.
And then I was still like, but I play the same music every time. I bet they hate that. So that just encapsulates freeze for me where it's like, you see everything as just kind of bad and tinged with despair and hopelessness.
And it just feels true. It feels so true.
And there was just so much. Oh gosh. I wish I could remember the person that said this.
And I think I've talked to you about it before, but they were saying that a regulated nervous system is not feeling calm. It's feeling at choice.
I love that.
When I was in the freeze, and I mean, it still happens sometimes just not nearly to the frequency that it did. I just felt like every single choice was taken away. The only choice that was there was to do nothing.
Yeah. And so many people who lived in a lot of fight or flight, especially the flight, they can kind of combine that freeze with flight. And so then you're like despairing and hopeless.
And then you're like, but if I could just get up every morning at five and do the 10 hour, not a 10 hour, the morning routine that I used to do in my 20s before I had kit, they're like, then we just put all this pressure on ourselves and then we feel hopeless again. And it's this sometimes can feel like opposing forces, not just fatigue, but this like antsy energy to do stuff. But then also this fatigue of like, I just can't actually get off the couch and do anything.
But then I feel really bad about it.
And actually, like one of the things that I have my clients do, especially if they experience a freeze response or they're feeling that fatigue, because they're not feeling safe in their bodies and they don't realize that's why they're feeling the freeze.
Yes.
I'll have them when they are in a regulated state, make two lists, like a list of the comfort list of things that bring them comfort so that they don't have to think about it in the moment.
So smart. Yes.
And then also a list of the things that they just enjoy. Oh, I love that.
Yeah.
It's like, because, like I said, they just feel like there's you're not at choice in that moment. And so when you've already made those decisions ahead of time, like, yes, like go do the things that's whatever is going to bring you comfort. I know I talked to you so much about like me.
My comfort is go lay down on the couch with my fuzzy blanket and watch some Netflix and sometimes have a bowl of goldfish.
Yes, I love that example because sometimes people are like, what's the like Wim Hof breathing method I need to do to calm my nervous system? I'm like, your body knows like, it's like your inner child knows to like curl up with a teddy bear or whatever, like do that kind of thing. What's called, I love that it's a bowl of goldfish too, because it even sounds very like a toddler, you know.
I didn't eat goldfish for like 20 years, like I don't even know like who I am, but as I was doing it, once I recognized that I was doing it deliberately, I would just like each goldfish that I would eat, I would be like, I'm safe. In this moment, yes, no danger. There's no tiger.
There's no lion and not shaming myself for being in a freeze response. Yes, yes, yes, yes, just narrating, narrating what's happening, like I'm eating a goldfish. Yeah, I'm scrolling on Instagram, like I tell myself, because, you know, we're like, we always want to get to present moment.
Like the easiest way to do that is to just say what's happening to yourself.
I love that. Yeah, because then you're doing it purposely. It's not like you're eating, you know, a whole bag of cookies all at once.
If you're eating one bite at a time, telling yourself you're safe, you know, chances are you'll eat just the right amount. Because I think you've even said with your like being able to eat different foods and I think even losing weight, like it's not like you're just turning to these self-soothing activities at your own body's expense. Like when you regulate, you are allowed to have some of those fun things and pleasures in your life and your body's actually healthier than when you're restrictive and not allowing them.
Exactly. Because, you know, I had told you I've been on every like every single elimination diet, like because they told me that a big part of my kidney disease was that I had inflammation in my kidneys and they could never figure out why. I'm like, interesting, interesting.
Yeah, maybe from from all the stress.
I mean, I also have a genetic predisposition to have a genetic disorder as well. But, but anyway, had been through all of those diets. And when you were like, yeah, the food doesn't cause the digestive distress, like distress.
I was like, what? I gotta go try that.
Yeah.
And now I do not eat a restrictive diet at all. There is nothing that's off limits for me, other than if I just don't feel like eating it. It's a relationship with body.
It's just like, do you actually want this right now? Yes, I do. And sometimes I don't.
Yes. And again, it's like you have choices that way. Back to choice.
Like I haven't heard it phrased that way. I would say like the opposite of that, you know, dysregulation is that safe feeling. But like the choice, when you have more choices in life of what you can do, where you can go, how you can move your body, how you can eat, then you have that fuller, richer life.
But when you have been told you can't eat these foods, and then you've experienced pain with movements, so then you decide you can't do those movements. Like, I mean, of course, it's natural. I'm not trying to say we're deciding it, but like, you know, we want to eliminate those things that are going to, quote unquote, cause us pain, not realizing that, you know, that's not even the source of the pain.
And since I have worked with you, I'm like, I have lost those 20 pounds and kept them off since November 21.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And you weren't like dieting and...
No, I was eating goldfish.
Yeah, exactly. I love that.
Not that I was eating goldfish every single day, but like when my body's like, hey, like you've overextended yourself, you didn't pay attention to me. You didn't listen when I was whispering. Now I'm screaming.
Better listen. And that's when I started to. So that's a lot of what I, you know, what I've learned for myself, what I teach is like, let's listen to the whispers before they become screams.
Yes.
Yes. I'm curious if you experienced this, because I definitely did. And I know a lot of my clients have, when we're starting to learn to self care, come out of freeze, to do these kinds of things that are in this loving way, starting to worry that like, oh man, am I just like, creating all of this so I can lay on the couch and eat goldfish?
And is this going to start to be my new life? And did you experience that?
And you're like, no, you're going to regulate, you're going to, your body's going to play some like, okay, I'm just going to trust her because that does not feel like it's going to happen. And I trusted you because that is the truth. Like, we're wired to contribute, we're wired to be creative.
We're not wired to just not do anything. Like, it doesn't feel physically good.
It's true. Like people who are always like, oh, I could just, you know, I just really have a problem with sleeping too much. And if I allow myself to sleep, then I'll just like, and I'm like, haven't you ever experienced a time where you actually want to get out of bed?
And everyone has, you know, you're, you've been in bed too long and you're like, it doesn't feel good to just stay in bed all the time. It does when you're in a freeze response or when you're dysregulated. But once you start regulating that, like you said, we, that is where we have that capacity to connect, to learn, to grow, to evolve, to help other people.
But when we're doing it from freeze or from a depleted place, you know, that's when we end up getting sicker and sicker.
Well, and I think that it was such a shift for me, like going back to just narrating when I was in a freeze response, because what I had been doing for years was beating myself up that I couldn't do anything. So it's just this chain cycle that was just like pile and compound and compound and compound. And so then I'm like, I haven't been doing anything.
Why don't I have energy? I should have energy because I didn't do anything, but there's a good way to rest and there's a crappy way to rest. And beating yourself up while you're resting is not, it's counterintuitive.
It's not productive.
That is so true. I'm glad you said that because so many people are like, oh no, I'm good at watching Netflix. I could do that for eight hours.
And but then they're beating themselves up the whole time and shaming themselves. And so that's really not rest at all.
Yeah, it's not. And really at the beginning, when I realized how often I was going into freeze and like that's what was happening to my body. I like, I had one client one time, she's like, well, what do you do?
Like when, when you're like, you need to sleep and you need to nap. I'm like, I did what Betsy taught me. I nap.
At the beginning, there was a lot of resting because there was so much that I quote, unquote had to catch up on because I had just neglected that part of me for so long. So, and because I made that investment in that current place of where I was at, I very rarely need to do that anymore. If I did, I would, but it's, it's, I, you know, yeah, I live a life, like it's living in a place where I'm like, oh, I'm going to do that.
I'm going to live a vibrant life because I'm able to live a vibrant life now. I think there's so much of this black and white thinking. And I got coaching one time where the lady was like, you know, there's more colors in the crayon box than black and white.
Yeah.
That's what happens when we're in an escalated nervous system state where like, there's only this way or this way. And so when I realized like, there's all of these emotions that I can choose, there's all of these different paths. Like, that's when the vibrancy and the color came back to my life.
Oh, my gosh. And it's back to choices again. I love it.
Right?
When we're like in that survival mindset, we're like, is it right or is it wrong? Is it black or white? And then when we have more choices, we're able to live that full vibrant life.
I love it. So for people who are struggling with energy, struggling with fatigue, maybe even I think it's really common that in earlier parts of our lives, we've been that fight or flight type of person. And then maybe it's when we have kids or in our 30s or 40s or not that it's age related, but more stress related because of the things that happen in those decades.
Then we go into freeze and then we're like, why do I have this brain fog? Why do I have this constipation and GI issues and all of the things that can come with freeze, including fatigue? What are your, I don't know, if you have some favorite tips or advice for people?
I think my favorite thing is just to be aware of what's going on in your body and not making yourself wrong for what's happening. Just really be experiencing it and like finding resources, finding resources, like what Betsy says, what I'm taught, like what I teach about too. And just learning about how you personally, it works for you to regulate your own nervous system, because there are so many choices in what you can do.
And it's just not thinking that there's a one size fits all. And if I just do this path, then I'm going to get out of this rut. Really getting to have an actual relationship with your own body.
People with chronic illness from what I've seen and from what I've experienced, we're just so disconnected from our bodies. And just take them for granted. We're like, brain, you just tell us everything to do.
We'll keep doing that until we can't do it anymore. It's taking that step back and really getting to know yourself really well. It's like, what do I even like?
What do I even want to create? What do I want the future to look like? Because chances are your brain is so focused on what has happened and what hasn't happened for you in the past.
That's what it's just trying to avoid creating what's already happened. Instead of being like, oh, I could create a new even better future.
Yes, and that just sounds so much like regulating that nervous system to me, right? You're in those fierce states of like, you know, the past and not letting those things happen again and wanting this sense of control and not, you know, and then when you're more in that safe ventral state, that's when you start to feel more energy. You have this bigger capacity to not get so dysregulated with all of the little things in life, so you can tolerate more, your window of tolerance grows, and that takes less energy because being in survival states takes energy, right?
Right? Yeah, so my energy, I'm just going to live in this.
Yes. Yeah. So even the way the body like shuts down during freeze to reserve energy, it's just like going into this like low heart rate, like stasis, kind of like preparing for death kind of state, and it's using more energy to do that than when we're regulated.
Yeah, exactly. And, you know, a couple of the modules that I take my clients through, like one of the first ones I do is rhythms and routines because we get so rigid in thinking this is how life should be. And if I don't have this exact thing happen, this exact way, the controlling part, Yes.
everything's going to go to pieces. And so instead, like, I talk more about like, okay, this is like an overall rhythm that's happening in your life. And you can just gently return to that rhythm when it feels good because sometimes life's going to happen.
So rather than beating yourself up and just seeing, okay, this is the overall picture and having trust and faith that all of the pieces are going to work out.
Yeah.
So I'm like, I always go back to like laundry, but I'm like, laundry is a rhythm. Okay, guys.
Right.
Mom, so you got chronic fatigue. It's like, oh, the laundry is never going to get done. But like if you put in tight, like these little systems that are easy to return to, then you don't have to get dysregulated because we weren't able to do the laundry how we want it to this week.
Like you can just return to gentle.
I love that because it's not even like the laundry, if it's done or not, that's a problem. It's how we're thinking about it, what we're making it mean about us, even the thought, it's never done, has that trapped feeling versus like, I have little bits of time during the day that I do it, and it feels so good to just get those, get the socks put away or whatever. I don't know how you suggest.
I just make my kids do all of their own since they were like five years old.
Yes. No, exactly. So many times we are low on energy because we're doing all these things for other people that we could actually enable them to be more self-sufficient and it could take a load off of our plate.
And you work primarily with moms, I think. So I'm sure you really see that because we're really trained to fill those roles and help everyone and give it our own expense. And it not only benefits you but everyone around you when you start to release some of those responsibilities you've been clasping on to.
Absolutely. Absolutely.
So good. Well, I love that you're doing this work, especially with energy levels, because that is just something that almost everyone talks to me about. And I've really thought at times in my life, I'm like, I think something is just wrong with me.
Because I had the belief I was just supposed to be happy all the time and have energy all the time. So just even being aware of how much the nervous system contributes to feelings of fatigue or brain fog or focus or memory or all of these things is just, you know, it's so helpful for people to know. So they don't think that something's just going wrong with them or, you know, this is just a result of aging or it's just perimenopause.
I guess I'll have this for 10 years and then whatever other symptoms, menopause, brain, you know, just, I love you're doing this work.
And I just, I think to myself, I'm like, if I could just teach or, or people could learn it from wherever, you know, I'm like, if I could just teach these women how to process emotions and sensations in their body with safety and how to regulate their nervous systems and how to, for them to figure out how to regulate their nervous systems in ways that work for them.
Yeah.
They would have all of the energy they could ever want.
Oh my gosh. I love that. Can you just say that one more time?
Because that I think is so important because it's again, yeah, it's more about like those two things, the processing emotion. Because when you say like tune into your body and get to know it, like maybe people are still like, I don't know what that means. Like, how do I just develop a relationship with myself?
But how you broke it down there?
It's really the two main things that I think about is learning how to process your emotions and your sensations in your body with safety.
Yes. Which is what we do in this pain reprocessing and it's for emotions too.
Exactly. Yeah. And then learning how your specific nervous system works, how to heal pieces of it, and how to bring just more of that aligned, calm, focused, energized state.
Yes.
And then you can do amazing things with all of the energy you need because you don't have all of the resistance. Because it's not about how many things you do, it's about all of those beliefs surrounding everything in your emotions and past traumas and things like that. That's your energy.
And you can borrow this thought if it helps you, my friends, but my thought is that I always have more than enough energy. Sometimes I'm using it a little inefficiently, but it doesn't mean that it's not there.
Oh, I love that. Okay. That just reminded me actually, because you have had some really good thoughts that have helped you.
I have one of them just written on a post-it note here. But if you don't mind sharing some of your favorite thoughts that have gotten you through, I think you've already mentioned one earlier. It was the, I beat the odds.
I beat the odds. Yes. So empowering.
And that might not resonate with anyone else that hasn't had a kidney transplant or whatever, or doesn't feel like they're at that point in their life. But any others that you remember?
It's so funny because while I was doing this work, I had posted after posted after posted of thoughts that I was incorporating. And as I incorporated them into my psyche, my subconscious, I've actually just taken them and thrown them away because I'm like, they're a part of me now.
Yeah. You have to remind yourself. I love that.
But I'll give you some. Like one of them that I that I still have up is that I'm saying no to perfectionism, so I can make space for something even better.
I love that.
And a question that I'm asking myself right now is, what is the influence I consciously want to create in my environment? Wow.
Instead of being reactive, that's like a way to have that intent about what you want.
And if you can see the video, I have this this little quote behind me. It says the world needs who you were made to be. I believe that about every single person.
And I've got another one. There's two more back there. One of them says she believes she could, so she did.
I just read that over and over again while I was on my treadmill. The last one is the magic is already inside of you. You don't need more of it.
You just need to remember it.
I love that. I love that. Yeah, I love that you have that like about magic.
And that's another reason we especially get along. And the one that I have from you, I don't know if you even remember, I have this from you, but it was, I'm the best me. Oh yeah.
That was a good one. That was a really healing thought.
Cause like we get into this compare and despair, or we compare ourselves to how we used to be, or, you know, we're just in freeze when we're doing that. But even just like, okay, I'm the best me. And sometimes that's freeze.
Sometimes the best me is like healing old trauma responses. And that's just the part of life I'm in and building my nervous system capacity, but I'm the best me. I love that.
Oh, I'm glad. I'm glad that helped.
Yeah. Well, it has been such a pleasure talking to you. I will link up any of your resources that you want to share.
And like I said, I've just cherished doing this work with you, seeing your progress and that you're now like have this special niche for especially moms with chronic fatigue. Because if it's treatable, and there are some ways that we can like help ourselves and have, you know, more capacity to help our kids. So good to know that.
Thank you so much. Yeah, I'll say to like when I when I was deciding, like who I was that I wanted to serve, I was like in a room full of amazing women and just like this energy was just palpable. And I was writing down.
I was like, who is it? Like, what is it? What do I do?
And I was just like wrote down moms with chronic fatigue, like before I even like could even it was pen to paper before it hit my brain. Wow. I just felt like full body chills and I was like, okay, that's who we're helping.
That's what we're doing. So I feel very blessed and very called to be able to serve that. And I just have to say, if you are listening to the podcast and you are on the fence about working with Betsy, get off the fence.
You will see so many results. Like there's just still things that I am getting results from. And I'm in her group program.
I'm like, I will always have Betsy in my life. Now it's a membership. Yeah, just so many amazing ahas and just incredible breakthroughs from things that she's taught me.
So thank you so much. Yeah, I love having you in that group. And it's nice just to know that you can always ask a question when you need.
But, you know, if you don't have to show up to every call or whatever, you're at this place where it's just kind of this maintenance. But as we go through life, you know, we always have some things that just regulate our nervous system if we're growing and expanding.
Exactly.
Exactly.
Thank you so much, Betsy.
All right. Thank you so much. Take care and we'll be in touch soon.
All right. Thanks, everyone, for joining. Thank you so much for listening.
I hope you learned a little bit about your brain today that helps you in your life like it helped me. Please be sure and subscribe and leave a review. And of course, be sure and share this podcast with someone you know that wants an Unstoppable Body and Mind.